Slight bias at the BBC ?

[qapmoc]

I saw on the TV today (BBC world service news) that during a riot in the Ivory Coast 10 people were ''KILLED'' but that during a riot in Irelend 6 people were ''MURDERED'', slight difference in viewpoint it seems!!

[jno]

could conceivably be a slip of the tongue. It's most unusual to say that people who die in riots have been murdered, because it's seldom true - murder involves deliberate intent to kill, and deaths in riots are usually accidental and unpremeditated. You could try contacting the BBC about this, they usually try to be pretty careful in their use of language.

[Ward-Minter]

jno, murder can also be "an intent to cause GBH" as well as the intent to murder.

"Malice aforethought" it is called as in R v Moloney(1985) AC 905.

january_bug have I got a good memory or what?

[delboy3]

Not so long ago the IRA were referred to in the British media as terrorists but their counterparts (UVF etc) were called loyalists. Both were bands of murderous thugs, so why the different tags, eh? Hmmm...

[Ward-Minter]

well off on a slight tangent Delboy I can explain. Yes, the UVF did undertake muderous acts aswell as the IRA. But, and it's a very big but, I as an Englishman and an ex-soldier who did two tours in NI had absolutely nothing to fear from loyalist paramilitaries.

It's the same way as women have nothing to fear from prostate cancer. Does that make sense?

So the powers that be, i.e British media, would naturally and in my opinion correctly, favour the loyalists.

[january_bug]

Well WM - I guess on the CPE you didn't waste any time analysing, interpreting or debating the law, just learning it off pat... unfortunate that it is always changing!!! I'm JOKING.... I have HUGE hang ups about the CPE, but I'm not having a dig at you cos you know your stuff! :-)

Yes, you do remember it very well indeed, and you're right again here - in the sense that only the intention to cause GBH is needed in a murder case. If the act of intending to cause GBH results in the victim's death, there is sufficient mens rea for a charge of murder. I remember that bit - and that was a while ago!

[Alan2]

Whilst we're on the subject, why was nelson mandela called a freedom fighter, when he was really an African terrorist

[jno]

something to do with him fighting for freedom, perhaps. Which bin Laden (for instance) isn't, so he's called a terrorist.

[surfer mike]

Alan i can see what side you are coming from politically.

[WaldoMcFroog]

Alan2, perhaps the following might answer your Mandela issue.

Mandela was initially committed to non-violent mass struggle against apartheid and worked for political campaigns such as 1952's Defiance Campaign. The campaign was based on mass civil disobedience based on non-co-operation with certain laws considered unjust and discriminatory. It sought full democratic rights for all South Africans regardless of colour or group allegiance. A fuller account can be found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defiance_Campaign - the mission statement reveals the peaceful intentions of the campaign.

He and 150 other activists were arrested and charged with treason in 1956. After a trial lasting from 1956-61, they were all acquitted. In 1960, South African police opened fire on a crowd of between 5-7,000 people that had gathered outside a police station in Sharpeville to protest the 'pass laws' - requiring all non-whites to carry pass books at all times - at the instigation of the ANC's chief rivals the Pan Africanist Congress. The crowd offered themselves for arrest. The police opened fire on them killing 69 and injuring over 180. Most of those hit were women and children. Although the reason for the police action is debated, contemporary photographic evidences shows no sign of weapons.

Uproar among blacks saw demonstrations, protest marches, strikes, and riots around the country. On March 30, 1960, the government declared a state of emergency, detaining more than 18,000 people.

A storm of international protest followed the Sharpeville shootings, including condemnation by the United Nations. As a direct result of the Sharpeville massacre, the ANC and PAC were banned, removing the rights of blacks to political process. It was this move that lead to the development of paramilitary organisations and the beginning of South Africa's international

[WaldoMcFroog]

In this context, Mandela headed the armed wing of the ANC and co-ordinated campaign of sabotage against military, government and civilian targets, and made plans for a possible guerrilla war if sabotage failed to end apartheid. He also raised funds for MK abroad, and arranged for paramilitary training, visiting various African governments.

On August 5, 1962, he was arrested after living on the run for seventeen months. He was charged with "leading workers to strike" in 1961 and "leaving the country illegally" and sentenced to five years in prison. Whilst in prison, he was also charged with sabotage and crimes equivalent to treason. He was sentenced to life imprisonment on 12 June 1964 The trial was condemned by the United Nations Security Council, and was a major force in the introduction of international sanctions against the South African government.

Whilst one does not condone the violence, it's pretty difficult to argue that Mandela did not have legitimate gripes with the South African government. With the right to legitimate protest banned and with abuses of the civil rights of blacks rife, it is not hard to see why so many would choose to call him a freedom fighter rather than a terrorist.

Food for thought maybe?

[WaldoMcFroog]

Missing 'isolation' at the end of the first answer!

[mycatis]

Alan2, Thank you!! I get really angry about the whole Nelson Mandella thing, glad you see him for what he is!
http://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/People_and_Places/Question115532.html

[surfer mike]

And most people see him what he ACTUALLY IS..

That is as a true international statesman, brave, courageous, kind and dignified.. and regardless what you or anyone who shares your right wing views think...thats what he'll always be remembered as..long after his death..