Novichok-Poison, Could It Be Russia's Fault Yet Again?

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5919211/Amesbury-couple-exposed-Novichok-poison-fight-lives.html

[Ken4155]

With Russia doing a very good job of hosting the World Cup and the Russian people being nothing but friendly to visitors from all nations, despite warnings to the contrary, it does seem a bit 'suss' that this should happen at this particular moment in time. Not beyond our very own MI5/MI6 to indulge in a little skulduggery :-/

[anotheoldgit]

naomi24

Don't you do the same naomi when others attack you, and you must get the last word in?

[ichkeria]

Yes it could and yes it is.
So there :-)

One presumes that these poor people have somehow come in contact with the original murder weapon which only goes to remind us how utterly reckless, ruthless, cynical and evil these people are.
Hitter ran a successful and friendly Olympics in 1936. However ...

[naomi24]

//Don't you do the same naomi when others attack you, and you must get the last word in?//

I defend myself aog, but I don't encourage their nonsense as you do. Incidentally, that last word ploy is designed by the intellectually impotent to silence intellect. A word of advice. It doesn’t work.

[youngmafbog]

"utterly reckless, ruthless, cynical and evil these people are. "

Tes, the Russians certainly can beand have been for many decades, but therein lies the problem. Why was such a mess made of it? The Russians (as many other Countries secret service) are very adept at making people disappear quickly quietly and definite. Something that has not happened here which is why I have my doubts on these particular incidents.

[anotheoldgit]

naomi24

/// It doesn’t work. ///

One has noticed. :0)

I know it is hot, but why have you got your frosty knickers on again, I did award you a BA, a thing that I don't lightly award.

[naomi24]

I don't own frosty knickers, aog. I say it as I see it and I simply see no sense in encouraging people who are very clearly trying to derail threads. And thank for the Best Answer on the other thread.

[anotheoldgit]

naomi24

Thanks naomi, but don't let their like drive a wedge between us, there are not many of us left on this mainly lefty site.

[Ken4155]

I am totally with ymf on this one. If the /Russians wanted to 'off' someone, that someone would be 'offed' and there would be no evidence to find. So the suggestion that this was the aftermath of the Russian's botched attempt of the Skrpal's lives doesn't sit well with me.

[Quizmonster]

As I pointed out on the Skripal threads a few months ago, the 'recipe' for making novichok was published in a book on the open market in the USA ages ago. An ex-colleague and friend of mine, a chemist, told me that HE could make it if he set out to gather the ingredients.

In effect, anyone like him could have poisoned the Skripals and may well have done so to the recent pair. The idea that no one except the Russian state could conceivably be responsible is absurd.

Please note, I am NOT saying the Russian state is innocent , but simply that they may conceivably be so. I'm fairly confident that none of us would be happy to accept a guilty verdict against us on the evidence our pathetic government is pleased to accept.

[Quizmonster]

"This mainly lefty site..."
Well, well; how misguided can anyone possibly be?

[ichkeria]

The people who know about these things have stated categorically that only a very specialised govt funded laboratory could have produced this substance. Just because ‘the recipe’s in a book’ does NOT mean any old individual or group could cook it up and why on earth would they bother anyway.
As for it not being Russia because it was unsuccessful, we should not make the mistake to think that ruthless and amoral always equals efficient. They messed up the Litvinenko killing as well, almost comically, even though sadly succeeding in causing death - eventually.
And the fact that people are critically ill having come into contact probably with the same material 4 months later shows how toxic it actually is.

[Togo]

This stuff does not degrade or lose its deadly effect with time. The only way to destroy it is incineration, and they will not be burning Salisbury down. I notice that the two latest victims appear to have very little "personal profile" to speak of or indeed report. No work or ex work colleagues have made comment. No family members of either appear to have raised concern or to make statements and express worries. All we have been told is that one was in receipt of a methadone prescription, and his "name", and that of his girlfriend. It does not smack of the whole truth to me. Have these two ever had contact with either our, or Russian intelligence agencies? Very deep work going on perhaps methinks. Both appear to have no discernable means of income but had what look like reasonable living quarters and lifestyles. Is the methadone story just part of the cover? It was established very quickly that he was in receipt of the treatment...….why?

[Old_Geezer]

Probably further spies indiscriminatingly dumping the incriminating evidence.
Can't believe anyone could doubt Russian involvement.

[Togo]

Got to agree Geezer. Also appreciate the dumping of further supplies theory. I just wonder whether they had contact somewhere along the line, however tenuous, with the Russians who vacated the country very quickly when the events began to unfold. I also note the very low key response from the Russians after this second "event".

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/amesbury-novichok-poisoning-latest-live-updates-as-sajid-javid-prepares-for-emergency-cobra-meeting-after-couple-exposed-to-same-nerve-agent-as-skripals/ar-AAzBYmZ?li=BBoPWjQ

[Ken4155]

Togo, Channel 4 news have her as living in a hostel. Looking at the CCTV of her in the shop (and reading between the lines) i would say she belongs to that group of people who share one another's pay day by supplying the booze/drugs. Looked like her two friends were doing the carrying and she was doing the paying.
They also had a scientist on who stated that it does degrade. She said that if it had been remnants of the first batch, it probably would have degraded sufficiently enough not to have caused identical symptoms the Skrpal's. She further said that it could be the same batch 'remixed'. But what do i know, i'm just a failed gambler:-)

[Ken4155]

Just read your last, Togo. The Russian newspapers and tv are full of it. Reporting pretty much everything that is being said on our news channels. Obviously, the Russian powers that be are again denying any involvement and are asking for evidence. Why are we not providing the evidence from the first instance? If it were a Court Of Law, we'd have to, would we not. Are we to believe our leaders simply because of the position they hold. They can't even tell the truth about Universal Credit, for Sean Dyche's sake :-/

[Togo]

Just thinking out loud on my part Ken. As I said, I think this whole "affair" is deeper than we are allowed to know. Where are the latest victims families and friends? As yet no "statements" for the rags to make headlines of. Did either of them know or have contact with the Skripals? The "funnies" always have deep cover for such events and know how to keep stumm. If they are indeed ruined people on drugs and alcohol, and have been recruited as gullible fools, ...…. By whom?

[Zacs-Master]

I just LOVE the hipocrisy on this site.

Naomi at 14:43 ‘So rather than discuss the topic, your purpose here is to attack aog. Jeez ....’

Naomi ten minutes later ‘Oh for God's sake, aog! What's the point of anyone trying to keep your threads on track when you're your own worst enemy?!

Jeez, indeed.

[Togo]

^^Yet another cerebral post from our master of bilious contribution. More poisonous than Novichok but much less effective.