Face Masks In Shops

[smurfchops]

Went into a Kingston on Thames newsagent yesterday, man in front of me didn’t have a mask, lady behind me didn’t have a mask. Guy behind counter had one, as did I, but he didn’t say a word to them. There is a police station across the road, six police sitting in a van outside. Nothing done.

[gness]

Pixie. You only have to look at the deaths of medical staff to know that a mask will not provide complete protection for the wearer or those close by. If they did we wouldn't still be needing to keep at a distance.
If I am sitting on a bus and hear some chap sneeze I'd be looking to see if he was wearing a mask and thankful if he was. You'll have seen the experiments early on showing how far the contents of a sneeze, a cough and even a shout can travel? Best kept in a well made mask... :-)

[pixie374]

Well yes, thanks, gness x although I would still be interested in the chemistry of it, as viruses are so tiny. NHS staff have sadly died, although I don't know about the handwashing and full details of the masks and how much they are worn. As I said, I would wear one when needed to... but they are nothing like the ones we "have to" wear for work, or my daughter does. It worries me that people might feel safer, even though they aren't xx

[woofgang]

Pixie the face coverings that the public are being asked to wear are not to keep virusses out but to keep them in...ie to catch the droplets that people exhale and keep them within the face covering

[pixie374]

I know, woof. I'm just wondering how they can work while still allowing people to breathe? Don't get me wrong, I am wearing them... but mostly to keep other people happy. I would just like to know how they are working xx

[ichkeria]

“ If I am sitting on a bus and hear some chap sneeze I'd be looking to see if he was wearing a mask and thankful if he was”

I wouldn’t. I’d be hoping he’d removed his mask and sneezed into a tissue. And I’m sure so would he

[gness]

Ich...I'll bet you've seen more people sneeze into their hand than into a tissue. I was being served in Tesco by a girl who stopped moving my groceries just long enough to catch a sneeze in her hand. I asked the manager to provide a box of tissues at each checkout with instructions if necessary....that didn't last long.... :-)

[woofgang]

Pixie, as I understand it, the idea is not to catch individual virusses but to catch the droplets that carry them

[pixie374]

Yes, me too, woof... but as viruses are so much more microscopic than oxygen or carbon dioxide, I am interested to know how only the smaller one is filtered out, but you can still breathe?

[ichkeria]

I’ve never really looked all that closely gness :-)

[New Judge]

//Not confusing, quite straightforward, just obstinate people refusing to do what they have been told.//

Did you check whether (a) they were exempt or (b) had a “reasonable excuse”? No, thought not. You simply assumed they were obstinate people. Ms Dick of Dock Green has a lot to answer for when she encouraged vigilantism by declaring she hoped people would be "shamed" into wearing masks (presumably because her organisation is, thankfully on this occasion, not up to enforcing the law.

//Ymb, whilst I am sympathetic to the ill treatment of your daughter you can't honestly lay the blame for that on anybody other than the shop assistant., certainly not on Boris or Hancock.//

Yes he can. Mr Hancock signed the SI and Mr Johnson was obviously in the loop when it was discussed. Without that SI none of this nonsense would prevail. It is hasty legislation, badly thought through (if thought through at all, that is) and of little or no benefit (and as I discovered yesterday, almost certainly a considerably increased risk to the wearer).

[davebro]

"but as viruses are so much more microscopic than oxygen or carbon dioxide"

Virus about 5 nanometers / gas molecule about 0.3 nanometers.

[Mamyalynne]

Rude treatment from retail assistants , I would lay the blame on poor training.

Not beyond the scope of anyone to come up with a simple way of communicating with customers who can't hear the spoken word.

[pixie374]

Where is that from, please, Dave? As it is the opposite of what we have seen with the coronavirus courses we had to do.

[davebro]

"Where is that from, please, Dave? As it is the opposite of what we have seen with the coronavirus courses we had to do."

Just a google search - stands to reason I think. An O2 molecule has 2 atoms - a virus cell has several million atoms!

[mushroom25]

from this - https://www.fpm.org.uk/blog/covid-19-sars-cov-2-pandemic/

//Human coronavirus particles are generally spherical, 120-160nm diameter and typically decorated with large (~20 nm), club- or petal-shaped surface projections (the “peplomers” or “spikes”), which give an image resembling the solar corona on electron micrographs of infected tissues and hence to the family name//

[pixie374]

Thanks both of you xx

[davebro]

Different virus cells can range in size - I quoted 5 nm as being the bottom end of the range.

[pixie374]

The reason I'm asking, is that the kind of masks that SS have suggested for myself and my sister - and, separately, the type my daughter has to wear in a care home- are so heavy that they leave marks on your face within an hour and are quite hard to breathe through. We are advised to take them off every couple of hours at least. Either they are being over cautious, or the fabric masks are under cautious. I don't think it matters about "work" or not, you are either in contact with somebody ill, or you aren't x

[poorclare]

You are lucky Smurf you can wear a mask, what about us
who cannot ~ lock me up and throw away the key ~ if it makes
you feel any better.

[Deskdiary]

Poorclare - if you cannot wear a mask, you don’t have to (although you can expect some pious prat having a go at you), and this is why the law is a total nonsense. I can wear a mask, and do wear a mask when shopping since Friday, even though it’s pointless doing so, because apparently I’m a threat, but somebody who cannot wear a mask can be absolutely riddled with the virus (they may not know) and not have to wear one.

It is a total, complete, and utter nonsense.

I have no problem with the people who are quivering with fear wearing a muzzle, but for normal people who understand the risk (such as it is - which is tiny) we should be left the F alone.