I Wonder Why This Number Is Rising So...
Politics0 min ago
Gordon Brown, "Uk Could Become A Failed State" ......
209 Answers
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Well if it does it'll be primarily your beloved Noo Labour's fault me old china, for enacting the devolution catastrophe. Is it time to reverse that and bring the Union back together? TBH I think England will thrive without the millstones of Wales, Scotland and NI anyway so it's them that need to get their April in gear.
Well if it does it'll be primarily your beloved Noo Labour's fault me old china, for enacting the devolution catastrophe. Is it time to reverse that and bring the Union back together? TBH I think England will thrive without the millstones of Wales, Scotland and NI anyway so it's them that need to get their April in gear.
Answers
I’m afraid I really don’t get where you’re coming from. When you said this: "...but the British seem to be rapidly giving up on Britain." I assumed that by “Britain” you meant the political entity that was Britain. But in the last few posts you seem more concerned about the niceties of what the remainder should be called were Scotland to gain independence
13:26 Tue 26th Jan 2021
It's the malaise of British politics for decades though, a London-centred parliament has favoured London and the South-east at the expense of the other nations and regions and now they have no answers when the electorate complain. Labour's answer was devolution. Johnson talks vaguely about "levelling up". Will the Tories really reverse decades of under-investment?
drmorgans: //"It's the malaise of British politics for decades though, a London-centred parliament has favoured London and the South-east at the expense of the other nations and regions and now they have no answers when the electorate complain. Labour's answer was devolution.// ok so now they run there own show, what's the problem?
// Johnson talks vaguely about "levelling up". Will the Tories really reverse decades of under-investment? "//
under investment?? UNDER INVESTMENT?? wow just WOW! ever heard of the Barnet Formula? Gawd help us you have free everything paid for by England and you still hate us and want more! PMSL!
// Johnson talks vaguely about "levelling up". Will the Tories really reverse decades of under-investment? "//
under investment?? UNDER INVESTMENT?? wow just WOW! ever heard of the Barnet Formula? Gawd help us you have free everything paid for by England and you still hate us and want more! PMSL!
"where have championed the break up of the UK? Where have I uttered and anti UK syllable? I'm trying to preserve the UK from the inevitable effects of Noo Labour's devolution catastrophe. "
Try:
"TBH I think England will thrive without the millstones of Wales, Scotland and NI anyway so it's them that need to get their April in gear. "
If you think that you cannot be much of a fan of the UK, tbh. Especially as, admittedly in my opinion, England would be much the poorer on its own, surrounded as it would by the dreaded EU (oh yes it would eventually!).
If England takes that attitude the union will split faster than you can sap "wee jimmy krankie" or whatever it is you call Sturgeon.
Try:
"TBH I think England will thrive without the millstones of Wales, Scotland and NI anyway so it's them that need to get their April in gear. "
If you think that you cannot be much of a fan of the UK, tbh. Especially as, admittedly in my opinion, England would be much the poorer on its own, surrounded as it would by the dreaded EU (oh yes it would eventually!).
If England takes that attitude the union will split faster than you can sap "wee jimmy krankie" or whatever it is you call Sturgeon.
ich: //"Try:
"TBH I think England will thrive without the millstones of Wales, Scotland and NI anyway so it's them that need to get their April in gear. "// - just stating the facts doesn't mean I want a break up of the UK.
//If you think that you cannot be much of a fan of the K, tbh.// - err I don't see why it's just a bot of realism. //Especially as, admittedly in my opinion, England would be much the poorer on its own, surrounded as it would by the dreaded EU (oh yes it would eventually!).// - possibly Wales/Scotland might get into the EUSSR but I don't think the EUSSR will survive long enough for us to find out.
//If England takes that attitude the union will split faster than you can sap "wee jimmy krankie" or whatever it is you call Sturgeon. // - no one will tell me what they want that they don't already have.
"TBH I think England will thrive without the millstones of Wales, Scotland and NI anyway so it's them that need to get their April in gear. "// - just stating the facts doesn't mean I want a break up of the UK.
//If you think that you cannot be much of a fan of the K, tbh.// - err I don't see why it's just a bot of realism. //Especially as, admittedly in my opinion, England would be much the poorer on its own, surrounded as it would by the dreaded EU (oh yes it would eventually!).// - possibly Wales/Scotland might get into the EUSSR but I don't think the EUSSR will survive long enough for us to find out.
//If England takes that attitude the union will split faster than you can sap "wee jimmy krankie" or whatever it is you call Sturgeon. // - no one will tell me what they want that they don't already have.
//you can't just let bits of your own country leave because they are not currently useful - the state has a duty to them.//
//You can't just cast off the expensive bits because they are not currently productive.//
No you can’t. But equally you cannot expect the currently productive parts to subside the less productive parts in order that they may provide goods and services that the more productive parts do not have provided for them. That is what is happening here. In being given control (and cash) to run their own services there has been a wide disparity in what is provided to whom. I’ve no objection to Scotland receiving a little more cash per head because of its geography. But I resent being told that as a result of this munificence the English must pay for (say) their prescriptions whilst the smaller nations do not.
//The union should not be treated a project of English dominance/imperialism over the smaller countries//
It isn’t. The UK budget is used to support parts of England differently depending on their current circumstances. But the payoff is that all of England complies with the policies laid down by the UK government. If there was ever a case for independence it would be for London and the South East – far and away the most productive area in the entire UK. People there do not mind the tax they pay being used to support parts of the UK differently and there is no widespread call for that area to gain independence. But when taxpayers in the South East see vast sums of their money ferried up the M6 each night to pay for free university places when their children have to pay £9k a year (and are not eligible for free tuition should they attend a Scottish university) you can understand them getting the hump when the Scots bleat on about how they are suffering “English dominance and Imperialism.” I don’t know of two many Imperialist ventures in history where those occupied were dominated by being showered with money and gifts.
//Blair could not possibly have foreseen how quickly the tables would turn; if he had he might have thought twice.//
But he should have, jd. It was blindingly obvious what would happen. The same thing has happened in Ireland following his “Good Friday Agreement.” So sacrosanct has this become that the UK has, de facto, been split as far as trade is concerned. “A border in Ireland is unthinkable, so we’ll have one in the UK instead.” An absolutely preposterous state of affairs where UK companies have to complete customs formalities to shift stuff from one part of the UK to another.
I believe the smaller UK nations are now more trouble than they are worth and the referendums I suggest should be held. In fact, as far as Ireland is concerned, there should be an additional condition and that is that either NI leaves the UK or they choose to remain. If they choose the latter the border on the island is reinstated. There’s far too much fannying around going on.
//You can't just cast off the expensive bits because they are not currently productive.//
No you can’t. But equally you cannot expect the currently productive parts to subside the less productive parts in order that they may provide goods and services that the more productive parts do not have provided for them. That is what is happening here. In being given control (and cash) to run their own services there has been a wide disparity in what is provided to whom. I’ve no objection to Scotland receiving a little more cash per head because of its geography. But I resent being told that as a result of this munificence the English must pay for (say) their prescriptions whilst the smaller nations do not.
//The union should not be treated a project of English dominance/imperialism over the smaller countries//
It isn’t. The UK budget is used to support parts of England differently depending on their current circumstances. But the payoff is that all of England complies with the policies laid down by the UK government. If there was ever a case for independence it would be for London and the South East – far and away the most productive area in the entire UK. People there do not mind the tax they pay being used to support parts of the UK differently and there is no widespread call for that area to gain independence. But when taxpayers in the South East see vast sums of their money ferried up the M6 each night to pay for free university places when their children have to pay £9k a year (and are not eligible for free tuition should they attend a Scottish university) you can understand them getting the hump when the Scots bleat on about how they are suffering “English dominance and Imperialism.” I don’t know of two many Imperialist ventures in history where those occupied were dominated by being showered with money and gifts.
//Blair could not possibly have foreseen how quickly the tables would turn; if he had he might have thought twice.//
But he should have, jd. It was blindingly obvious what would happen. The same thing has happened in Ireland following his “Good Friday Agreement.” So sacrosanct has this become that the UK has, de facto, been split as far as trade is concerned. “A border in Ireland is unthinkable, so we’ll have one in the UK instead.” An absolutely preposterous state of affairs where UK companies have to complete customs formalities to shift stuff from one part of the UK to another.
I believe the smaller UK nations are now more trouble than they are worth and the referendums I suggest should be held. In fact, as far as Ireland is concerned, there should be an additional condition and that is that either NI leaves the UK or they choose to remain. If they choose the latter the border on the island is reinstated. There’s far too much fannying around going on.
"People there do not mind the tax they pay being used to support parts of the UK differently and there is no widespread call for that area to gain independence. But when taxpayers in the South East see vast sums of their money ferried up the M6 each night to pay for free university places when their children have to pay £9k a year (and are not eligible for free tuition should they attend a Scottish university) you can understand them getting the hump when the Scots bleat on about how they are suffering “English dominance and Imperialism.” I don’t know of two many Imperialist ventures in history where those occupied were dominated by being showered with money and gifts. " - Bang on judge. Untitled/ich et all - have an attempt at commenting on this paragraph from the judge.
//That is all the more reason to try and preserve it//
The only way to preserve it is to reverse devolution. It was always going to end in tears. Devolved administrations simply crave more and more powers and in the end the amount they crave makes it no longer possible to preserve a union. As in England, the smaller nations can still have their local authorities who can concentrate on emptying the bins and fixing the pavements. There's more than enough industry in waste collection to keep the local busybodies occupied so they don't have to interfere with people going about their lawful business. That used to be a simple affair - you put all your rubbish out in a dustbin or black bag and it was collected once a week. What happened to it after that was not your concern.
//- the alternative is no more Britain.//
Then so be it because - particularly as far as the Scots concerned - it's becoming more bother than it's worth. It's make your mind up time and quite honestly the English voters should be asked what they want as well. He who pays the piper calls the tune.
The only way to preserve it is to reverse devolution. It was always going to end in tears. Devolved administrations simply crave more and more powers and in the end the amount they crave makes it no longer possible to preserve a union. As in England, the smaller nations can still have their local authorities who can concentrate on emptying the bins and fixing the pavements. There's more than enough industry in waste collection to keep the local busybodies occupied so they don't have to interfere with people going about their lawful business. That used to be a simple affair - you put all your rubbish out in a dustbin or black bag and it was collected once a week. What happened to it after that was not your concern.
//- the alternative is no more Britain.//
Then so be it because - particularly as far as the Scots concerned - it's becoming more bother than it's worth. It's make your mind up time and quite honestly the English voters should be asked what they want as well. He who pays the piper calls the tune.
The attitude that the smaller nations must dance to England's tune because they are (not by choice) dependant on money made in England. The attitude that Scotland or NI are irrelevant because they are smaller than England. The attitude that the smaller nations of the UK are "millstones" because they are - at this point in their history - less productive than England.
"Then so be it because - particularly as far as the Scots concerned - it's becoming more bother than it's worth. "
I do not think we should give up on preserving the union just because it's difficult. I care very much whether or not Britain continues to exist and I do not want my country to be disestablished because people like you are too lazy to keep it.
"Then so be it because - particularly as far as the Scots concerned - it's becoming more bother than it's worth. "
I do not think we should give up on preserving the union just because it's difficult. I care very much whether or not Britain continues to exist and I do not want my country to be disestablished because people like you are too lazy to keep it.
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