Emigration

[Dassie]

So the latest statistics announced today that around 590,000 people immigrated to the UK last year.
I wonder how many of these were actually qualified in one profession or another to benefit the Country?
Also in the light of the Government's admission that it had no idea how many illegal immigrants had arrived, can we actually believe this figure?

And 400,000 Brits left the UK in the same year........um......I wonder why ? (not)

Would you leave if you had the option and means to go ?

[Dassie]

....."It's a shame that people are still that naive that they think the grass is greener on the other side of the fence"

No, not naive at all......If you have lived and worked in other parts of the world you'll see how c**p the UK is when it comes to medical treatment, public services and lifestyle.

.....and how exactly am I going to make a difference when there's never any real sums of money provided by Government to improve and or pay for increased policing/ special constables, the latest drugs, getting rid of MRSA & Cdiff., building and staffing hospitals, updating our railways etc etc? Nobody cares and it's like f*rt**g against thunder.

[Oneeyedvic]

.....and how exactly am I going to make a difference when there's never any real sums of money provided by Government to improve and or pay for increased policing/ special constables, the latest drugs, getting rid of MRSA & Cdiff., building and staffing hospitals, updating our railways etc etc? Nobody cares and it's like f*rt**g against thunder.

Oh apathy - that will work then.

Why not get involved in your local area. Being a Special is local and most forces always need more.

What about becoming a magistrate - again, most areas always want them.

How about a Samaritan, a Citizens Advice Bureaus volunteer, be a School Governor or whatever.

There will always be an excuse for not doing something - no money, no time, no whatever. It is people that makes a country Great, not the government.

Stand up and do something about it rather that just sitting around complaining.

[anotheoldgit]

If you don't like the way kids are brought up, go into schools and help out. ??????

So you think one could go into schools and alter the very system on which the school runs? How long do you think you would last, one would soon be thrown out on one's ear.

If you don't like the way the council is run, stand to be a councillor.??????

Again if one councillor tried to change the partie's policies, he or she would soon be out voted.

If you don't think the police do a good job, become a special.?????

One special constable against the Goverment, Police Authority, Chief Constable, don't make me laugh.

Any other good ideas Oneeyed?

I have, the sooner this country is ruled on strong Right-Wing principles the better. We have tried the Liberal Left pussy footing ways, and look where it has got us. It is time for strong zero tolerance measures.

[Oneeyedvic]

Firslty, I do go into schools to help out. Our local Chamber of Commerce has gained funding to go into schools and I along with many other business men and women go into the local schools and help teach the children a few times per turn.

Have you ever been a councillor or do you actually know any?
I know several and they are people who give up their time to try and help others. Still, much easier not to know them and cast aspersions on them isn't it? Incidentally, I have been asked to consider standing at the next local election.

So you want strong right wing principles with zero tolerance? This country has never had those principles. Perhaps you should emigrate to the middle east - they are pretty big on the zero tolerance extremism over there.

So come on, what are your ideas? Isn't it easy to mock other's ideas.

As I said - easy to moan - far more difficult to do.

[Dassie]

There's a BIG difference between helping out and being able to CHANGE anything. Both my brother in law and I have helped at a CAB thank you.
Without serious investment into any undertaking you are not going to get anywhere and politics will also dominate whether it is party or individual positional.
My ideas....start with the parents and schools to bring back discipline. Follow that with a year's military service for all school leavers ( homebased - not Iraq etc ). Means test ALL State benefits to allow more money to be invested in railways/hospital clean ups etc.

Britain is now a third world country in many respects and as I said if you've worked and lived abroad it's not being naive as you seem to think about greener grass!

[Oneeyedvic]

You talk as if you were well travelled. If you seriously think that England is comparable to a third world country then I'm sorry but you really have no clue as to the real world.

Show me somewhere in England where the majority of population live in tin shacks. Where you can't drink the water as it will kill you. Where people die of starvation.

I'd love to know in which third world countries you have lived and how you would compare it to England.

The economy? The infrastructure? The education system? The free healthcare? The opportunities?

[Dassie]

Yes, I am well travelled and have lived and worked abroad and so I can speak with authority. It's a comparative subject.... so I say "Third World" UK firstly because there is no "Second World" when discussing nations and because the health care, infrastructure etc is hopeless when compared to REAL first world countries such as Australia, New Zealand, Canada, USA and South Africa.
Yes, with the status of the 5th richest economy I agree the UK should be First World but in truth it lags behind. The French and Japanese have a better rail system, The S.African medical facilities are second to none ( World's first heart transplant ) Vancouver is one of the best and cleanest cities I have seen - more than you can say about any UK city with litter all over the show etc etc. and of course no British yob culture.
Try travelling the world - it broadens the mind and your vision of life.

[Oneeyedvic]

I have travelled the world - every continent with the exception of Antarctica.

Every city/country you mentioned is classed as a first world country. You are the one comparing England to a third world country - not me. Try living in a country like Sri Lanka, Egypt, Bangkok. These are third world countries. Then try comparing England to it.

I can't remember which ABer mentions comfy western armchairs - it has never been so true with your descriptions - your travel experience obviously only comprises of 'nice' places and big cities.

[Dassie]

Yes, every one I mentioned is First World.........that's my whole point which you seem not to grasp. The UK is nowhere as good as them and yet it is supposedly the 5th richest Country in the World.

Of course I have seen the tin shacks in Africa etc. and I'm not saying the UK is as bad BUT it is not on a par with those Countries I mentioned. Second World would probably be a better description but that saying doesn't exist.

[Oneeyedvic]

Okay, lets look at the countries you mention:

USA - no free health care - if you can't afford it tough. Look at New Orleans and what happened there. Economy not doing brilliantly. Almost three times the amount of murders per person.

South Africa - Second in the list of murder countries of the world 35 times more likely to be murdered over there than in UK. It is classed as the most dangerous country in the world that is not at war. 1 in 5 adults suffer from HIV / AIDS.

Australia has its issues with it aborigines (you know the people who lived their originally). They are pretty much displaced and treated as second class citizens (you know that thing you really hate about this country).

Welcome to your Utopias.

[jno]

I believe the aboriginals' main problem was... unrestrained immigration, Vic.

Are the people who moan about how the government never has the money to sort out the problems they want, the same ones who scream about rising taxes? I fear they may be.

[sp1814]

Dassie

Why are you so disloyal to your own country?

Don't you think what you've written is a bit...well, a bit disgaceful?

[sp1814]

There's something you also don't cover in your posts.

Life elsewhere may be great for you at your particular time of life, earning what you do, and being the race that you are in other countries, but isn't that just displaying old 80's style "I'm out for me, and screw the rest" thinking?

I thought we as a nation had left that behind by now.

[Dassie]

Oneeye......Nobody said these countries were Utopias but in general you get better service and facilities and value for money available to you than in the UK.
I'm not measuring it on who has Aids etc and who gets something for nothing, but the QUALITY AVAILABLE to the individual. That's why my original question asked about option and means (money) to go.

sp......"isn't that just displaying old 80's style "I'm out for me, and screw the rest" thinking? I thought we as a nation had left that behind by now"

No we haven't .......and that's probably why the Government wants to get people off benefits as announced today. How many freeloaders are there out there with the above attitude. Criticism isn't being "disloyal", it's highlighting how the UK could improve its services to match those in other parts of the world such as medical services and trains to mention but two..

[sp1814]

There are aspects of many, many, many countries which have it better than us.

However, its easy to pick and choose what you see.

If I were a New York stockbroker, living on the Upper West Side with a supermodel wife, I'm gonna think life is pretty sweet in the US.

However, if I were a grandmother who lost everything in Katrina and then had the indignity of waiting a week for FEMA to get it's act together, my opinion may be different.

It depends what you look at.