Listener 4158 - Two Little Words by Danda

[starwalker]

Another week, another puzzle, another debut.
Straightforward and fairly easy. Once the phrase is found everything falls neatly.
Thanks D and A (?)

[TheBear69]

Actually, with the same computer but using Chrome instead of IE the page break comes after 3down, so the image prints larger. There must be some IE setting to shrink things....

[dr b]

I cut and paste into Word so that it all fits on standard 8.5 x 11 inch paper (copy grid, paste clues into 2-column table, paste preamble to right of grid); but then I don't submit the puzzle.

Anyone looking for more puzzling fun might try the Wall St Journal's cryptic which is usually pretty simple but has a clever grid today:

http://online.wsj.com...ts/puzzle20111008.pdf

[AndrewG-S]

I print straight from the website come out over 2 pages with the split after 9d. Grid is about 9cm wide. But once or twice in the last few weeks second page has not printed so I have had to paste into word

[jim360]

Out of interest, how many people who solve listeners end up not submitting them, and if not why not? I won't be this week and probably for a while because I've already got the new BRB and don't need another - same for others?

[trux]

TB69, AG-S - curiouser & curiouser : I printed off website, no mucking about with settings, and break comes after clue for 24 Down (I then cut out remaining clues from second page and stick them onto first sheet ... a bit Blue Peter-ish, I know but it's become a habit)

[dr b]

jim360, no interest in paying overseas postage for a prize I have no need for!

[BlackHugh]

Jim360 - regarding submissions: the wonderful people at St. Albans collect statistics on how many you have correctly submitted in each year, which are available, on application, in about March. I understand that if you get each one right that year then you get invited to the Listener Dinner - sadly I have not so far been eligible :-)

[AndrewG-S]

OK I was holding of whingeing but I have been submitted EV and L for what seems like ages and still no sniff of a win. 4 years now on EV and 1.5 on L. I realise every time I say this someone pops up and says they have submitted for 25 years and got nothing. I am clearly on that path.

[u10]

Good to see a name check in the grid for a much lamented Listener setter. I can't imagine that he ever served up one as easy as this!

[Nical]

Andrew G-S - I don't normally do the Listener puzzle, but I've sent off the Times weekend crosswords for over 30 years and have won absolutely nothing. On a brighter note, I've won 10 dictionaries this year in crosswords in other papers.

[ichkeria]

"I understand that if you get each one right that year then you get invited to the Listener Dinner"

I think that concession ended years ago. Too expensive! Not quite the rare achievement it used to be.

[easterfool]

Well it must have been easy- here I am all done and dusted on Saturday. The odd unclued entry caused a bit of a problem, but I see that I wasn't alone there. I thought that I wouldn't have many threads to read, but reading them has taken longer than doing the crossword - and was slightly more interesting. Still as one who can't set, I shouldn't be so critical.
Still hoping for a full year, so there must be a real stinker coming.
I was invited to the Listener Setters' Dinner once many years ago, when it was free to all-completes, but now they have to pay for the meal and the hotel, I understand.
I too will have to find something else to do over the next week. Good to see so many new folk joining in. Hope that you get as much fun from the Listener as I have over the years.

[AndrewG-S]

Nical, what on earth do you do with 10 dictionaries per annum!! Sounds like you must submit on a lot of crosswords. I imagine the Times weekend crosswords (excluding the Listener) have quite a lot of correct entries so from a probability perspective it may not be so unusual that you have not won. The Listener on the other hand has about 1500 each week so if you have submitted that for 30 years that is about 1500 submissions so it should be your turn pretty soon. Best make a place for the new BRB.

[Staurologist]

There are on average about 500 entries to the Listener each week. If there are three prizes, your chance of winning in a fair draw is 3 in 500. So you would need to submit about 166 correct puzzles to meet the average chance of winning. Assuming an 80% success rate in solving, that means about 200 puzzles, i.e. once every four years. Even then, you might not win, because the 95% confidence range around a value of one [win] includes zero. For EV I suspect the entry rate is higher, say 1500, so you might have to wait 12 years before winning, if at all. But keep trying--chance being what it is, it might happen next week!

[AndrewG-S]

Thanks Staurologist, that means my wait is shorter than I expected. Had I know I would not have invested in the new BRB.

[abns]

I usually start off submitting at the beginning of each year, then forget to post one on time sometime around March and then start posting again the next January...

[aldanna]

I always submit the ones I have finished correctly (or think I have). The glory of winning is all, as I have no interest in the normal prizes (though winning a new BRB would be nice) but it is interesting to get the statistics each year and see where one stands, and how clever other people are. I progress a little up the list every year - extrapolating, I should get them all right by the time I am about 120.

[Nical]

Andrew G-S - re my dictionaries, my local primary school and various friends have found a home for them all. I buy my own Chambers.

[LankyLanky]

1hr 25m. A little too easy, Danda.
For an easy gridfill, perhaps a more difficult ending ?

Yes, CJ, I found that my S-Matrix account was no longer usable (this is the only forum I ever used it on). But LankyLanky will do nicely !
Try not to meddle.

[ichkeria]

"For an easy gridfill, perhaps a more difficult ending ? "

Dear me no. I disagree. What's more irritating than a nice, satisfying solve - as this was - full of clever but accessible clues, followed by a last step out of all proportion difficulty-wise to what has preceded it - simply for the sake of being difficult. I don't think that's what the Listener is about at all.