Can The Marxist Mantra Ever Work?

[naomi24]

This question arises from a conversation I had here earlier - and it’s something to talk about other than the miseries of Coronavirus so that can’t be a bad thing.

So … the Marxist Mantra -

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs".

Can that ever work in any society - and if not, why not?

[Philoctetes]

The whole statement is a universal description of a fair and just society - it is certainly a good description of Christianity, for instance. Not to mention the Conservative party (yes! and most other political groups).
The problems come not only with "ability" but also "need". Does anyone "need" beer, for instance? Or butter? Or to join a bridge club? Or have a university education? And too often "ability" comes down to "more than I have so he must share"

[sevenOP]

Marx stipulated a very exact set of circumstances to be achieved before those words could apply.( they were the END not the MEANS)

The simplistic idea there is only one type of Marxism is as facile as thinking there is only one type of capitalism/democracy/communism/Christianity, which should be clearly visible to all but the doctrinaire.

[naomi24]

Allen, //No, I just enjoy poking sticks through the bars.//

Not so. You think that’s a smart way to defect rational argument …. but it isn’t. It's cowardice. Rational argument requires rational response. The ball is in your court.

[Theland]

Beware of United Nations Agenda 21, more terrifying than the Marxism you fear.
Formulated in 1992 and signed by 176 nations.
A plan for globalisation run by corporations and NGO's and completely undemocratic.

[allenlondon]

Hello sevenOP, good to read some rational thinking, a welcome oasis in this desert.

I was thinking of pointing out that the central thought that Marx was writing about was actually a very old idea, formulated since people started wondering how society could be better organized; but pearls and swine occurred to me, and I kept schtum.

[waterboatman]

In theory it's perfect, in practice it doesn't work, because there always have to be leaders telling the others what to do and when, and because they are leaders they want a bit more of the cake. therefore, communism, however you want call it, cannot work.

[fiction-factory]

I recall you're an admirer of China, allenlondon. Would you regard that as a successful Marxist system? What about Russia today or the old Soviet system? Is there an example of where it's worked successfully?

[archibaldy]

Marxism is alive and well on a local level and is the only way that friendships, clubs, groups, charities and random acts of kindness work. All apart from the least sociable and most criminal help others and will give what they can to those that need it. However outside of these relationships or organisations inherent human greed and distrust mean that competition for resources will always occur within wider society.

[sevenOP]

""From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs".

Can that ever work in any society"

Yes, according to Marx, in the society he delineated the specific conditions under which such a creed would be applicable.

[naomi24]

SevenOp, //Can that ever work in any society"

Yes//

How?

[sevenOP]

"SevenOp, //Can that ever work in any society"

Yes//
How?"

The answer was in the part you deliberately cut out.

See Naomi, some of us WILL answer questions
https://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/Society-and-Culture/Question1699559-4.html#answer-12370697

"The ball is in your court."

[naomi24]

SevenOP, I didn’t ‘deliberately cut anything out. Saying "according to Marx, in the society he delineated the specific conditions under which such a creed would be applicable.”, isn’t an answer. I asked ‘How?’

I didn’t see your question in the link. Thank you for bringing it to my attention.

[ynnafymmi]

I thought Karl Marx was a philosopher rather than a politician.His views were maybe ok back in the 19th century.As for their relevance now,dont make me laugh.Groucho,Harpo and Chico spoke more sense.

[naomi24]

SevenOP, I've answered your question on the other thread.

[sevenOP]

Marx gives the circumstances that would enable 'From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs' to work in his Critique Of The Gotha Program

https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.131494/mode/2up

[naomi24]

SevenOP, I'm not asking Marx - and I'm not about to read a voluminous tome - I'm asking you. How?

[sevenOP]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critique_of_the_Gotha_Program

[sevenOP]

This could help

~“from each according to the capitalist’s need, to each according to the capitalist’s greed!! ” has been abolished :# “from each according to their abilities, to each according to their work” is what we are fighting for ; #and “from each according to their abilities, to each according to their needs” is our inspiration and ultimate destination. ~

[naomi24]

SevenOP, In an effort to define precisely what the Marxist mantra really means, and your contention, SevenOP, that Marx had the answers, I’ve looked at several websites without success. I came across something that said workers would be paid in vouchers… ? …. but I can’t find out whether or not those employed in jobs that require greater education, skill and expertise - a brain surgeon for example - reap more lucrative rewards than say, the man who cleans the toilets - and hence ends up much better off - which would surely defeat the object, wouldn’t it? Further, the proposal is that everything is owned collectively by the workforce, in which case who manages it all, who makes the big decisions - and is he paid more for shouldering that responsibility than the man standing on a production line and making up cardboard boxes all day? If not, what is the incentive to burden oneself with the responsibility of becoming a manager? Do Marxists ask themselves those questions - and if so, what answers do they get? Do please explain, SevenOP. I’m fed up trailing websites.

[sevenOP]

"according to Marx" @ 00:32 Sun 05th Apr 2020 were the exact words I used Naomi and "and your contention, SevenOP, that Marx had the answers" were what you converted them to.

You are looking for the validity of a "Marxist Mantra ( your words ), which are *always* quoted out of context = DELIBERATELY weaponized, which Marx said could only, yes only, be applicable at the end of a long struggle.

From what you say @09:48 Tue 07th Apr 2020 it seems your research has only led you to more questions, but no answer.
I will try to be helpful:

http://www.politicalaffairs.net/you-might-be-a-marxist-if-you-believe-in-from-each-according-to-their-abilities-to-each-according-to-their-needs/