Muslim Beliefs

[grasscarp]

With Muslims in the UK establishing their own schools, one wonders how their children will acquire our values and be able to integrate into our society

An MP recently attended a training session where there was a presentation by three speakers from the Roman Catholic, Protestant and Muslim faiths, who explained their beliefs. He asked the Imam about the fact that most Imams and clerics of Islam have declared a Holy War against the infidels of the world and, that by killing an infidel they earn a place in heaven. He asked “can you give me the definition of an infidel?’

There was no disagreement with my statement and, without hesitation he replied, ‘Non-believers!’ The MP told him that he had a problem with being his ‘friend’ when he and his brother clerics are telling followers to kill him

Perhaps some muslims reading this would like to comment on their beliefs and how they can expect to be welcomed and integrated among people that they have orders to kill!.

[suzie1]

so what if muslims dont want to aquire 'your values' they have values of thier own that they would like to aquire. so what if muslims have schools of their own in britain, they have contributed to the society and to britain, so they are entitled to have their own schools etc, but not all muslims send their children to muslim schools, their are alot of asian children in normal sstate schools, its what they prefer, and they have that choice. killing people is not the answer to anything, people should learn to respect others religion/belief and be a bit more open minded and stop being so shallow and stereo typical. people should accept everyone, regardless of their colour, religion and beliefs, and the killers should be executed! im not pointing this to anyone in particular, its just my opinion.

[Ankou]

and comendable it is too suzie.

noami

"i know you're asking me, but isn't me who objects to what Muslims perceive as our values, so best ask them." but you were backing the first line in the original question - in some bigotted way i wonder ??

how does it make a good question, if you can't explain what 'our values' means. if you, who presumably possesses these 'values' can't explain them, then why should a muslim ? it is (i am guessing) non-muslims putting this argument forward, but it seems, with little to back it.

[naomi24]

Oh dear. Sadly, yet again, Ankou, you're wrong in your assessment and you're wrong in your assumption. Ask Keyplus what he thinks of our values, and why he doesn't want his children to acquire them. He's told us many times, but I'm sure he'll oblige you.

[Ankou]

ask the one muslim on ab. thats representative is it ?

you reseve compunction to privy us with your own "values" that you believe "the muslims" should aspire to.

i shoud have expected no more no less.

[suzie1]

are any of you muslim

[Ankou]

not me suzie

[naomi24]

Haaa! Any port in a storm, eh Ankou? How funny! You're making it up as you go along. Where have I said I expect Muslims to aspire to my values?

We do only have one Muslim here, that's true, but nevertheless, he is a devout Muslim, and I would suggest he's more qualified to speak about what Muslims want than you are. Or perhaps you disagree?

[suzie1]

whos muslim then, naomi you said there is only one

[suzie1]

10clarionst, religion is not a hobby or past time, it is a part of who we are and we shouldnt take it lightly, it is IMPORTANT to many of us, but we should impose what we believe in on to others

[suzie1]

sorry, {error in my last comment} we should 'not' impose our believes on to others,

[blackeyed]

Keyplus is not the only muslim on this site ,i am probably the second one-though, i usually don't take part in any discussions or arguments as i don't have a vast knowledge about Islam.
As much as i know about Islam a non-believer is only to be killed when he is suppressing a muslim in some way or when there is a need for the expansion of the Muslim Empir and in today's world i see the need of neither(except for,places like Iraq,Kashmir etc.)
I've lived in Pakistan for quite a long time and i've seen all kinds of different people over there,there are some real extemists as well as some non-Muslim population and i've never seen or heard about a 'believer' killing a 'non-believer' just because he's not Muslim.
I just don't know why people who call themselves Muslims portray Islam in such a bad light!!!

[naomi24]

Suzie and Blackeyed: I think there are a few more Muslims on the site, but Keyplus is the only one, to my knowledge, who contributes in this section.

[Ankou]

noami, the q says "aquire" our values rather gthan aspire so i take that back since i guess your values are nothing to aspire to.

but why should they aquire our values ?

[grasscarp]

Why should anyone bother to acquire the values of the country that they have moved into, or go to existing schools or places of worship etc when they can come here and turn it into a scaled down version of the country they came from - with benefits.

[naomi24]

Ankou, I didn't say they should aspire to, or acquire our values, and you know nothing about mine, so that makes several times you guessed wrongly today. Must try harder!

[Ankou]

are you actually adding anything to this thread noami other than tediously dreary put downs ? i know that is usual for you, but i thought for once you might actually stand up for something you have said.

nomai "Actually, I still think you first paragraph makes a good question"

so what did you mean by that ?

[naomi24]

Ankou, what on earth are you talking about?

[Ankou]

ah classic. straw man fallacy. well done.

[jackthehat]

Ankou - I have read back through this thread and must admit I am puzzled by your comments to naomi.

As far as I can see there IS a question in grasscarp's first paragraph and naomi merely pointed this out..........
You obviously have 'previous' with her but I fail to see quite where your argument is headed here.
The question posed by grasscarp is moot. Would the acquisition of our 'values' be a positive or a negative thing for muslims ? IS integration into a larger non-muslim society something to which muslims would 'aspire' ?

keyplus regularly explains that he does not wish for his children to acquire the decadent and unseemly behaviour he sees from British children. As he is the (in the main) sole muslim contributor to this site, we have only his opinion, as a good and devout muslim, to use as our yard-stick.....