Gay Pupils Insulted By Homophobic Phrases

[mushroom25]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/24984781

the word "Gay", from the French "gai", meaning joyful or bright and showy, was increasingly appropriated in the last century to mean a particular lifestyle associated with orientation. Now it's been appropriated by others to mean something else.

Language is constantly evolving; is this something that the LGBTI community needs to "get over", or is the word "gay" now irrevocably locked to its 20th century meaning?

[jomifl]

sp I'll try to decode it for you..
'suicide' means killing yourself, not attempting to do so.
I searched for gay suicide rates but it seems that there are no reliable statistics available as there are too many vested interests and bad statistics. One figure (30% of all suicides are gays)was obtained by rounding up from a quarter to a third the number of gays committing suicide and then making the assumption that 10% of the population was gay when we know that this is not true. Some surveys state that the suicide amongst gays is not significantly higher than amongst the straight population.
So that issue is probably a dead duck.
My point about gay suicides being brought about by the militant outing of gays is only valid if there has been an increase in the gay suicide rate.
Your claim of 'shockingly high attempted suicide rates' led me to wiki which in turn claimed that the actual suicide rate amonst young gays is 400% that of the population as a whole. However further research has thrown doubt on that so it may not be an issue at all.
My remark about apologies referred to the idea that if there was an increase in the gay suicide rate then it was almost certainly due to gays being subject to undue pressure to ''out' themselves when they were no mature enough to deal with the consequences. 50 years ago homosexuality was only mentioned in the media when a 'celebrity' or civil servant was arrested for importuning in a public lavatory. Nowadays hardly a day goes by when there isn't as gay related story in the media. Public awareness of gay issues has been as a result of gay generated publicity( I don't think most straights really care about it). If gay publicity hasn't quite had the intended results it is not the fault of anyone else.

[jomifl]

Kromo, I do take your point, and I don't think gays should be treated differently to anyone else but my point is that you cannot re-engineer society without getting some unwanted and unexpected consequences and this is what we have. Major changes in society have always produced 'backlashes' and victims an example is the bad treatement that a lot of women got over female emancipation.

[Kromovaracun]

That's very true. I still think it's rather unfair to blame them for it, though. If somebody attacks you, then the one responsible is your attacker.

[jomifl]

Kromo, if you stick your hand in a wasps nest and get stung...who is to blame?

[jackthehat]

Are there any statistics for attacks on gay wasps resulting from their decision to 'come out of the hive'?

[doctordb]

Jomifl - if it's not on private land, the council.

[doctordb]

Words have so many different meanings to many people.

I don't like it when people say 'I tolerate homosexuality'.

To me 'tolerate' means to dislike but put up with. 'accept' is a better word.

[Kromovaracun]

Jom

Homosexuals are not responsible for the stupidity, aggression or violence of other human beings. All they've ever asked is to be treated like everyone else. If that is enough to earn them a beating, then they are not to blame for it.

[pixie373]

No, of course they aren't, kromo. And it makes no difference what percentage of the population is gay. Everyone has the right to live how they want while it doesn't hurt anyone else.

[jomifl]

Kromo,
/Homosexuals are not responsible for the stupidity, aggression or violence of other human beings./

and neither am, I so I avoid stupid aggressive and violent uman beings. When I was a kid living on an east london council estate and going to a grammar school I quickly learnt a lot of things. Some areas are best avoided, some people are best avoided and some situations are best avoided. Don't stand out by dress or behaviour don't attract attention and don't look like a victim. Somehow gays are being identified as such by nasty people, how do they do that and can they avoid it?

[sp1814]

"Somehow gays are being identified as such by nasty people, how do they do that and can they avoid it?"

In the case of the barman who was murdered in London a few years ago, he was followed from the gay bar he worked in.

[sp1814]

In the cases where gay teens have been thrown out of their homes, onto the streets, it's because their parents have either found out themselves, or the teen had plucked up the courage to talk to them about it.

Most parents love their kids no matter what - some don't.

[sp1814]

"Kromo, if you stick your hand in a wasps nest and get stung...who is to blame?"

Are you suggesting that...that...

Actually, what are you suggesting?

That gay people who are verbally and/or physically assaulted somehow bring it on themselves?

Is this the same school of thought that suggests that young attractive women who dress provocatively can only blame themselves if they get raped?

[jim360]

Some of jomifl's post seem to be really ... odd. I hope I've misinterpreted what you are saying, to be honest.

[sp1814]

jim360

Yeah...the female emancipation thing...that was a bit of a 'left hook'.

[jomifl]

Jim, please explain what you find odd? I have no antipathy towards gays, I am just trying to explain how some of the problems that gays encounter may have come about from a non gay centric viewpoint. A gay barman gets killed, so it is because he is gay ...of course. A heterosexual barman gets killed is it because he is heterosexual? probably not. As I've said earlier I've been around long enough to see the whole gay rights thing develop and I don't hink the militant gays such as Peter Tatchel have done their fellow gays any favours.

[jomifl]

sp, yeah, it's all the fault of everybody else.

[naomi24]

//I don't hink the militant gays such as Peter Tatchel have done their fellow gays any favours. //

Neither do I.

[jim360]

I deliberately didn't explain what I found odd in case I had after all misunderstood. I'm still not entirely convinced otherwise, but never mind.

Peter Tatchell actually strikes me as a very important figure in the whole debate, really, rather than someone who isn't doing favours for the community. You may or may not have had the chance to see him on Question Time during an edition that focused on gay marriage, when he had to stand some of the most extraordinary comments by Ian Paisley Jr.... "Gay people can get married -- to a woman!" among other such dross. He strikes me as a very tolerant person who is aiming for equality for all and not just for gay people.

[jomifl]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Tatchell#OutRage.21