Shouldn't This Peaceful Silent March Be Allowed To Take Place Without Violent Opposition?

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/pegida-uk-hundreds-attend-birmingham-central-mosque-opposition-tommy-robinsons-anti-islam-march-1542279

[andy-hughes]

retrocop - //A-H
You skirt around the issue of civil disobedience and disruption though. How convenient and typical! //

I am not 'skirting round' anything - nor is it 'typical' that I do so.

I am pointing out that the issue of status is important in the debate - and that two of the three people you mentioned were elected MP's, and Mr Robinson is entirely self-appointed.

If you want to discuss civil disobedience, then that is another issue - please bring it into the discussion by all means, but until it is mentioned, you cannot fairly criticise me for 'skirting round' it

[retrocop]

Ah. I note that it is only just before 10am and the inevitable pattern emerges.
I'm off out of here.

[andy-hughes]

retrocop - //Ah. I note that it is only just before 10am and the inevitable pattern emerges.
I'm off out of here. //

That's a shame - I will never know your response to my last two posts.

Oh well ...

[agchristie]

Ichkeria - the media though will only report what they want to report rather than give a true perspective. That's not me with a complex. Some things are perceived to be too controversial but the truth hurts doesn't it however some choose not to believe it....

[ichkeria]

I misguidedly supported CND back in the day, but I'm not sure they wanted to take the law into their own hands, did they? They just thought we should get rid of our nuclear weapons, and carry on without them.
The problem with Pegida is that, however well intentioned many if not all of them may be, they do imply or arouse feeling of hate in one section of the community on account of their religion. That is something I've seen before in another part of the UK. Hopefully we would not have the scenes witnessed on the continent repeated here, where marches were accompanied by serious attacks on refugees.
This sort of thing always happens when a group of people feel that the law is not arranged in a way to deal with what they see as a perceived threat: the problem is the law is all we have. As long as they obey that and don't become a law and order issue themselves, as their counterparts in some places elsewhere have done, then I don't have a problem. There is no harm in having silent marches.

[andy-hughes]

AG - //Ichkeria - the media though will only report what they want to report rather than give a true perspective. //

Does that explain their endless obsession with the 'Islamification' of Britain, which they bang on about every day with a 'y' in it?

[ichkeria]

and Pilate said "What is truth?"

I've never forgotten that ...

[ichkeria]

"The media", Andy is shorthand for "the media we don't like"
As opposed to the media who tells us what we want to hear. That sort of "media" is usually called "I read it in the paper" :-)

[agchristie]

> As long as they obey that and don't become a law and order issue themselves, as their counterparts in some places elsewhere have done, then I don't have a problem. There is no harm in having silent marches

....but some on here have a problem with this and are expecting TR/Pegida crossing the line. Early evidence disproves that. To some their very existance is a threat.

[andy-hughes]

ichkeria - //"The media", Andy is shorthand for "the media we don't like"
As opposed to the media who tells us what we want to hear. That sort of "media" is usually called "I read it in the paper" :-) //

Absolutely.

I find it astounding that people believe a media that is still mired in the residue of the phone hacking scandal - and that was used entirely to manipulate stories - even create them.

If a daily paper told me the day was Tuesday, I'd check a calendar!

I have direct experience of the media, and its ways of distortion, and that is only the entertainment area - god alone knows what they do with 'news'!

[agchristie]

The media stated that there were only 150/200 Pegida supporters whereas the primary source in Tony's link stated far more. Who do you believe? Could it have been a cynical ploy by the media to show what paltry support they had on the day?

[andy-hughes]

AG - //The media stated that there were only 150/200 Pegida supporters whereas the primary source in Tony's link stated far more. Who do you believe? Could it have been a cynical ploy by the media to show what paltry support they had on the day? //

There is no real assurance that either are telling the truth - both have vested interests in their version of the facts being seen as the correct one.

[agchristie]

> Hopefully we would not have the scenes witnessed on the continent repeated here, where marches were accompanied by serious attacks on refugees.

Maybe there wouldn't be a need to have marches/protest groups if we didn't have so many attacks on the young/old/males/females/journalists etc !!!

People feel unsafe and some lecture instead on how women should dress. Amazing....

[naomi24]

^Absolutely. Crazy!

[agchristie]

Even politicians aren't permitted to say use force 'where necessary'. A perfectly legitimate comment but seen as not PC.

[anotheoldgit]

sp1814

/// Didn't you know about the links between EDL and the BNP, who have a rich history in anti-Semitism? ///

Have you seen me quoting the BNP, regardless of past links the EDL may have had with that organisation, I am still waiting for proof from you of the EDL (who I did mention) attacking Gays, Blacks or Jews.

/// Have you heard of The Daily Mail, The Daily Express and the Telegraph? ///

Yes of course I have heard of them, but I have not witnessed any of these publications quoting the merits of Tommy Robinson, Pegida UK, or the EDL.

[anotheoldgit]

sp1814

/// But to be serious for a moment...Pegida have an image problem. ///

/// As long as they look like footie hooligans, they will be held at arms length by most people. ///

/// Image is really important. ///

Seriously?????????? well you must be because you have already made that clear.

Perhaps the Nazis are more acceptable to a person so fashion concious as you? One could not be any smarter than them?

[andy-hughes]

AOG - //Perhaps the Nazis are more acceptable to a person so fashion concious as you? One could not be any smarter than them? //

Adding insults like this to your disgusting reference yesterday to my supposed 'defence' of molesters, which you have conveniently ignored as you usually do when challenged - is making you sound like a nasty reactionary bigot - perhaps you should think before you press submit.

[sp1814]

AOG

When you speak of 'attacks', are you limiting that to physical attacks?

If so, search for 'EDL Bristol Pride attacks'

Then have a search for 'EDL leaked emails'.

Then search for EDL and Terry Jones.

[sp1814]

AOG

I believe that image is important. If Pegida had a much broader spectrum of support, then I think that their message would be treated seriously by a broader audience.

Oh, and by the way - the Nazi comment is an invocation of Godwin's Law.