Anti-Trump Protests Across Us

[naomi24]

//Demonstrations are being held in cities throughout America, with some protesters burning flags and refusing to accept the result.//

http://news.sky.com/story/donald-trump-and-barack-obama-to-meet-for-white-house-talks-10651739

What do they hope to achieve? What CAN they achieve?

[Zacs-Master]

Togo.....I thought we were 'remanaics'?

[andy-hughes]

Naomi - //Zacs-Master, not going to get you where you want to be though, is it. That's the bottom line. //

It's not, and they probably know that, but doing something, even if you think there is a better than even chance that you won't succeed is part of the human condition.

It's what made sailors circumnavigate the earth, even though they understood that there was a very real chance of either being eaten by dragons, or falling off the edge.

If mankind had analysed the chances of success before every endeavour attempted, and decided not to bother, we would be nowhere.

We would certainly not enjoy the democratic freedoms that allow these people to take to the streets for a bit of a protest.

[Khandro]

“Now there is a leader, despite all the negativity spread about him by the political elite and the press, he has only one concern, and that is the national interest of the voters of America who are concerned about immigration, who are concerned about the job loss as a result of globalization, who are concerned about the Islamisation of their society, and he tends to say the truth and convince people that if they start moving, anything is possible, and I believe the historical event of yesterday will have an enormous effect on European politics as well.”

Geert Widers

[Khandro]

Wilders

[Togo]

Old hat that Zac. Remoaners or Wrexiters now.

[andy-hughes]

Khandro - what we have is a leader who has got himself elected by pandering to the wishes of the majority of people willing to vote for him, and in that sense, he is exactly the same as every elected leader in every country there has ever been.

If the American people had wanted to wage war on Mars, Trump would have promised it to them - because promises win votes.

What now has to happen is Mr Trump delivering - or not - on those lofty promises.

As I pointed out on another post - President Obama promised in his first campaign that the day after election, he would close Guantanamo Bay.

Promises are one thing - delivering them is entirely another.

[melv16]

Re Guantanamo Bay. As I understand it, Obama did try to close GB, but Congress put a block on his proposals.

[andy-hughes]

melv - then he should not have promised something that he can't deliver.

Rather like Mr Trump and his Muslim exclusion and wall - and 'making America "great" again' - whatever that means - if you can't deliver it, don't promise it in your campaign.

[Ellipsis]

Obama couldn't deliver the closing of Guantanamo because he didn't win the elections (plural) that he needed to win in order to deliver it. Had he had the required power, he may or may not have delivered it - as it was, there was no way he could. Congress thwarted it, which was the will of the people who gave Congress that power.

Trump on the other hand has all the power, as long as he can bring his GOP to heel. So can we expect to see every single one of his promises delivered? I hope not ... and already, in his conciliatory tone to Clinton, it seems that he is not going to "Lock her up", despite the fervent chanting of many of his supporters. Say what you need to say to get into power then dial back and deal with the consequences is the approach that he seems to be taking ... which again is hardly (small d) democratic, but is probably a good thing when you consider some of the things he did say!

[naomi24]

andy-hughes, //It's what made sailors circumnavigate the earth//

You give them far too much credit. These idiots can’t get their brains to successfully circumnavigate the result of an election let alone the earth!

[andy-hughes]

divebuddy - //Andy, you said...//they understood that there was a very real chance of either being eaten by dragons, or falling off the edge. //

But there wasn't a "very real" chance of that happening, was there. There was no chance at all, in fact. //

Of course not, but you know that via the wonderful concept of hindsight, and several centuries of science and exploration.

For sailors at the time, those fears would have been absolutely real, and the testament to their courage and vision is that they went anyway.

[hereIam]

God give him a chance, he's not even sworn in yet !

[fiction-factory]

They can't change the result and probably don't expect to, but want to express their disappointment and let Trump and others know they are concerned at some his views (in the perhaps vain hope he may rein some ideas back), just as much as Trump supporters want to celebrate and show the world their delight that their man won. Both seem fair enough to me.

[naomi24]

Sailors of old went forth to circumnavigate an unknown earth and that was a testament to their courage and vision - and they are favourably compared to the idiots who are creating mayhem in the US because they don’t want to accept the result of an election. I must be missing something here.

[jim360]

"...if people are intent on levelling that sort of criticism, then they should level it across the board – not just when it suits them. "

You mean like how I spent ages in the wake of, and the build-up to, the UK General Election criticising the system for how skewed its results were -- in particular with regards to UKIP?

[naomi24]

Jim, I can't remember what you said then, but I do see what one or two people are saying now.

[jim360]

It's not entirely accurate to say that the UK and UK system are the same anyway, so it's perfectly possible to criticise one and not the other. Right now -- of course -- the focus is on the US system. For the record, the system isn't flawed just because it let Trump win, but because it allows anyone to win despite receiving fewer -- in principle, far fewer -- votes than his or her opponent. Had Clinton done the same, it would still have been stupid (and, I expect, easier for those who like Trump or hate Clinton or both to notice).

[Khandro]

andy; The building of a wall along the Mex/US border isn't new and it isn't Trump's idea alone, walls have been in place for decades. At the moment about one-fifth of the nearly 2,000 mile border is fenced.