Family & Relationships3 mins ago
Brexit Delayed Until 2021
The British public have voted, so why the delay ?
Is it:
1. May's heart isn't in it and will be gone by the next election. Leaving someone else to tidy up the mess
2. An admission that our Trade Negotiators are useless and 3 years time is beyond them, and they need 2 extra years to catch up.
3. She is too busy trying to save her own neck than concentrate on what is best best for the country.
4. May is the wrong person at the wrong time to be PM.
5. We are all f******ed
Is it:
1. May's heart isn't in it and will be gone by the next election. Leaving someone else to tidy up the mess
2. An admission that our Trade Negotiators are useless and 3 years time is beyond them, and they need 2 extra years to catch up.
3. She is too busy trying to save her own neck than concentrate on what is best best for the country.
4. May is the wrong person at the wrong time to be PM.
5. We are all f******ed
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As ichkeria says, the reason for this is that everybody knows 2 years is not long enough to negotiate trade deals, because trade diplomacy just is a far, far slower process than your average member of the public thinks it is.
A cynical part of me wonders if this is laying the groundwork for having the UK permanently in transition - i.e. pretending to be leaving, forever. I hope I'm just being paranoid, because this would make no sense economically or morally, but it would be very politically expedient.
A cynical part of me wonders if this is laying the groundwork for having the UK permanently in transition - i.e. pretending to be leaving, forever. I hope I'm just being paranoid, because this would make no sense economically or morally, but it would be very politically expedient.
Lets not lay all this fiasco at the feet of May. All the main political Parties had a policy to remain, bar one.
Boris is being feted here as some kind of future saviour, but he too was in favour of remaining.
The reality is that no country has ever left the EU, and nobody really knows how to go about it. David Davies has been on the Brussels Shuttle every month for ages, and we are no nearer a solution than we were the day after the Referendum in June 2016.
May is now following Labour policy and begging the EU for another 2 years grace. Lets hope they agree.
Boris is being feted here as some kind of future saviour, but he too was in favour of remaining.
The reality is that no country has ever left the EU, and nobody really knows how to go about it. David Davies has been on the Brussels Shuttle every month for ages, and we are no nearer a solution than we were the day after the Referendum in June 2016.
May is now following Labour policy and begging the EU for another 2 years grace. Lets hope they agree.
Mikey,
Not really true to say the Conservative and Labour Party supported remain. Both were split, and both had top level MPs supporting the Leave campaign.
The majority of Conservative MPs wanted to remain. Those MPs desperately do not want a Leave MP being Prime Minister, which is the only reason that May, a terribly weak leader, remains in power.
The 2015 Conservative leadership election (as wasn't) was nobbled to prevent a ballot of grassroots Tories, who would not have elected May.
Not really true to say the Conservative and Labour Party supported remain. Both were split, and both had top level MPs supporting the Leave campaign.
The majority of Conservative MPs wanted to remain. Those MPs desperately do not want a Leave MP being Prime Minister, which is the only reason that May, a terribly weak leader, remains in power.
The 2015 Conservative leadership election (as wasn't) was nobbled to prevent a ballot of grassroots Tories, who would not have elected May.
But having to deal with not having got off one's rear and agreed a deal in time, must be a great incentiviser.
The way to get out of doing something is to find plausible excuses to procrastinate until it never really gets done. The UK have made perfectly reasonable solutions to all demanded issues, Macron is talking nonsense when he implies we should be clearer. The ball was in the EU court to make a sensible move, not the UK's.
Lack of progress is down to Barnier & Co's attempts to stall everything by not offering a serious, acceptable way forward. The EU's banning of talks in areas where progress can be made is unforgivable. Yet it is a weak May that blinked first and started crumbling; trying to look "reasonable" by offering concessions but she's simply showing a lack of ability. As mentioned, the ball wasn't in her court. It's beginning to look as if she needs replacing after all, for the sake of the country.
If two years isn't long enough then why should four, or six, or eight, or ten or ..... Either there is the will for those in the high paid job positions to do the job they are paid for, or there's not and some are simply trying to push things back until either they're retired, or the issue is dropped.
The way to get out of doing something is to find plausible excuses to procrastinate until it never really gets done. The UK have made perfectly reasonable solutions to all demanded issues, Macron is talking nonsense when he implies we should be clearer. The ball was in the EU court to make a sensible move, not the UK's.
Lack of progress is down to Barnier & Co's attempts to stall everything by not offering a serious, acceptable way forward. The EU's banning of talks in areas where progress can be made is unforgivable. Yet it is a weak May that blinked first and started crumbling; trying to look "reasonable" by offering concessions but she's simply showing a lack of ability. As mentioned, the ball wasn't in her court. It's beginning to look as if she needs replacing after all, for the sake of the country.
If two years isn't long enough then why should four, or six, or eight, or ten or ..... Either there is the will for those in the high paid job positions to do the job they are paid for, or there's not and some are simply trying to push things back until either they're retired, or the issue is dropped.
"All the main political Parties had a policy to remain, bar one. "
All that shows is how antidemocratic a party system is.
On getting the true democratic decision of those represented all should have switched to lining up with that decision; and that doesn't mean pretending to whilst watering down what needs to be done until the party/parties gets it's own way in practice.
All that shows is how antidemocratic a party system is.
On getting the true democratic decision of those represented all should have switched to lining up with that decision; and that doesn't mean pretending to whilst watering down what needs to be done until the party/parties gets it's own way in practice.
Mikey, //They lack the balls to get rid of her, at least now,//
Or to put it a more honest way, they have the sense not to spark a leadership election right now.
Cloverjo, //I still blame Cameron. It was he that called the referendum and then waltzed off to leave others to sort out.//
It’s true he called a referendum and waltzed off when the result wasn’t as expected, but had a different leader called for a referendum do you think the result would have been otherwise?
Or to put it a more honest way, they have the sense not to spark a leadership election right now.
Cloverjo, //I still blame Cameron. It was he that called the referendum and then waltzed off to leave others to sort out.//
It’s true he called a referendum and waltzed off when the result wasn’t as expected, but had a different leader called for a referendum do you think the result would have been otherwise?
Old Geezer,
So you blame Macron and Barnier & Co for lack of progress instead of May and Davis.
You may well be right, the only problem is, we are not privvy to the UK position, it seems to be secret. I have no idea if we are acting in good faith or not because I have not been told a thing. It has taken over a year for the £20bn exit fee to be suddenly made public, and everyone knows that that figure is not the fee we will eventually pay.
We may well get 2 more years, or even 5 more years to get a deal, but we won't get any answers from our politicians until it is too late.
So you blame Macron and Barnier & Co for lack of progress instead of May and Davis.
You may well be right, the only problem is, we are not privvy to the UK position, it seems to be secret. I have no idea if we are acting in good faith or not because I have not been told a thing. It has taken over a year for the £20bn exit fee to be suddenly made public, and everyone knows that that figure is not the fee we will eventually pay.
We may well get 2 more years, or even 5 more years to get a deal, but we won't get any answers from our politicians until it is too late.
Mikey,
I didn't watch the speech, so I do not know if she uttered £20bn.
But that is the figure widely reported (and not corrected by Downing Street) as our offer.
If she did not say it, that further supports my arguement that we are being kept in the dark about what our negociating position really is.
I didn't watch the speech, so I do not know if she uttered £20bn.
But that is the figure widely reported (and not corrected by Downing Street) as our offer.
If she did not say it, that further supports my arguement that we are being kept in the dark about what our negociating position really is.
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