Brexit - What If?

[Arrods]

The PM swallows his pride, sends the extension request to Brussels and it's refused (as one French minister has opined). What then?

[naomi24]

Jim, //MPs were instructed to leave the EU//

And they voted overwhelmingly to implement that instruction. They failed - and they failed deliberately.

//I know I've said this like 100 billion times before but it still bears repeating. //

I too know you've said it 'like' 100 billion times before - and no, it doesn't bear repeating ever again. It's disingenuous nonsense.

[tonyav]

Jim, tell me where Cameron mentioned anything about a deal, no deal or any type of deal. I voted out, I like many others that voted out voted that way not caring about a 'Deal' we voted that way so as to leave the EU.

https://scontent.fbhx3-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/69652106_2263144670460707_5697088287794003968_n.jpg?_nc_cat=103&_nc_oc=AQnHrCTkmz2U1zITQckU19c8rhTYgA9-yJtz7nvjUzi4RHrAG4teJYC0DdBTaLybyfE&_nc_ht=scontent.fbhx3-1.fna&oh=0ccb5845a17648c81ef7406c05ec3c92&;oe=5E15DCA2

[naomi24]

I expected deals to be negotiated ... trade deals ... security agreements ..... but I certainly didn't vote to leave this country tied to EU rules and regulations in any shape or form.

[THECORBYLOON]

TONY, have a look at the information in the documents here that were issued prior to the referendum.

https://www.gov.uk/government/topical-events/eu-referendum/about

[THECORBYLOON]

Those documents were issued by Cameron's Government and he would have been aware of their contents.

[tonyav]

l will do, THE CORBYLOON, although your link is dated The United Kingdom is leaving the European Union on 31 October 2019.

[THECORBYLOON]

It says "The EU referendum took place on Thursday 23 June 2016. On this page you’ll find information that was distributed about the referendum."

[jim360]

I'm sorry that you find representative democracy disingenuous nonsense right now, but it's still how this country is meant to work.

I saw your post, Naomi, in the thread about how to vote for in the next election. I can only suggest that you vote for the Brexit Party candidate, assuming there is one in your seat come the next election.

[naomi24]

Your advice isn't sought, Jim.

[jim360]

I didn't expect it to be, but I didn't see any harm in offering it either.

[naomi24]

No interest.

[Old_Geezer]

A representative democracy can be a practical solution provided the views of the public are actually represented, and claims about it still being democracy if the representative does their own thing ignoring those they clsim to represent weren't made. But we see from the current situation that it is not so, so it's an illusion that we have even a representative democracy.

[anotheoldgit]

If by law we are forced to stay in the EU, I do hope that the remainers will be only too pleased to receive their calling up papers when the EU decide to introduce an EU Army?

Talking of these overnight introduction of certain laws ie preventing Johnson from calling a General Election, stopping him from leaving the EU without a deal and forcing him to request a further extension etc. I find it rather strange when generally when new laws are introduced it generally take months or even years before they are brought into force.

[Zacs-Master]

Probably be more pleased than the leave voters.

[ichkeria]

The law currently forces us to LEAVE the EU
The law stopping Johnson from calling an election was passed by the Tory Lib Dem coalition back in 2010.
I don’t think the EU is planning conscription either.

[Zacs-Master]

https://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/uk-exhausted-from-arguing-with-brexit-fkwits-20160713110699

[mushroom25]

looks like Boris won't need to break the law.
https://www.thelocal.fr/20190908/foreign-minister-france-does-not-support-brexit-deadline-extension

when he asks for an extension (as he must), the answer will almost certainly be "Non". and you can kinda understand the reasoning:-

the EU grants an extension. Parliament kicks the can down the road.
the EU grants an extension. Parliament kicks the can down the road.
the EU grants an extension. Parliament kicks the can down the road.
the EU grants an extension. Parliament kicks the can down the road.
the EU grants an extension. Parliament kicks the can down the road.
(repeat ad-infinitum)

[jim360]

The EU Army thing is a bit weird to bring up. Even assuming that the EU does get around to introducing it, which is doubtful (and, ironically, more likely with the UK outside than in) conscientious objection is still a thing, so it's not like anyone can be forced to join.

The only law preventing Johnson from having an election is the Fixed-Term Parliament Act, which was passed in 2011 after a long -- and, presumably, not entirely rigorous -- consultation. The speed at which the No Deal legislation is introduced is, in the meantime, clearly dictated by circumstances. Regardless of the rights of wrongs of the law, there would clearly be no point in taking months or even weeks to debate a law that needs to be ready by this Wednesday if it's to have any purpose at all.

And, besides, it's also worth noting that, even if we do agree a deal with the EU -- or, for that matter, leave with No Deal -- then the lack of time before departure is going to necessitate even more laws being passed far more quickly than usual.

[davebro]

The Germans will tell the French what they have to do.

[anotheoldgit]

jim360
/// The EU Army thing is a bit weird to bring up. Even assuming that the EU does get around to introducing it, which is doubtful (and, ironically, more likely with the UK outside than in) ///

If the UK rejoin the EU, they will have to do what their masters tell them they must do, I wouldn't even rule out the end of the Pound and the introduction of the Euro.

/// conscientious objection is still a thing, so it's not like anyone can be forced to join. ///

That is true, but then just like Boris is being warned of, they could face a jail sentence.