The Historical Jesus.

[Theland]

Compared to other people in history, there is a wealth of documents to support the existence of Jesus, and His ministry on Earth, yet critics pour scorn on His very existence, but have no trouble believing in other figures for which there is only fractional evidence.
Is this a correct assertion that I have made, or am I somehow mistaken?
The scorn, that is, not the existence of Jesus.

[Aquagility]

I think that very few people doubt the existence of Jesus.

[Doc Spock]

Wealth of documents.????

There may have been some bloke called jesus or whatever.

But water into wine, come on, get real.
What gives with the capital H ?

Fairy stories for people with no intelligence.

[Theland]

Thank you. That's encouraging. But I think that there are many ASH's on AB who would disagree with you.
I think any noise you might hear from now on will be them gathering for an attack.

[Doc Spock]

What is an ASH?

[Theland]

Atheistic Secular Humanist.

[jackthehat]

Come, come, Theland, you know that there is an absolute dirth of contemporaneous documents supporting the existence of Jesus, biblical or otherwise.

And can you expand upon these 'other figures' you mention ?

[jno]

are you suggesting the tooth fairy doesn't exist? Shame!

Actually, I don't think there are any documents proving Jesus' existence; the earliest date from a generation later. I have no problem believing the story was handed down orally in the meantime, that would be normal for the period. But documentary evidence, no.

[jno]

...like Jack said while I was typing out my post...

[whiffey]

There is more documentary evidence for the New Testament than for any other ancient document. Yet how many modern people would accept without question that Caesar invaded Britain in 55 BC or whenever just because they read it in Caesar's Gallic Wars ?

Water into wine - why not ? Walking on water ? Why not, ought to be straightforward for the Son of God.

Why should the NT have to be scientifically sound ?

Why would the writers of the NT make things up ? I cannot see any possible motivation for Paul to write a pack of lies and 'invent' a religion. Moreover, I cannot see why a group of utterly depressed disciples, frightened after the crucifixion of their master, should suddenly transform into joyous martyrs - a man does not die for something he knows to be a lie.

It's nothing to do with intelligence Spock, keep your scorn for more deserving subjects.

[Theland]

I am suggsting that there are many copies of the gospels and letters from very early periods, that sit quite well when compared to other documents supporting the existence of other figures. Like Egyptian kings perhaps? Roman Emperors?

[whiffey]

p.s. excellent book, Jesus: The Evidence, by Ian Wilson.

http://www.amazon.com/Jesus-Evidence-Ian-Wilso n/dp/0895262398

[Theland]

Thanks Whiffey - one of my points exactly.

[Doc Spock]

I do not scorn. I simply say given the magnitude of the universe (infinity) how on earth can anyone sane person believe in the notion of a man with a long white beard sat on a cloud above us.

Explain existence, I can't. Oh it must be god then. Doh!

[Theland]

Doc Spock - For somebody who you believe never existed, He has had mighty influence on the whole world since His "alleged" Earthly visit.
Not an influence that is easily ignored is it?
That's quite an achievment for a nobody, or the figment of some first century author. There you are, the calendar revolves around Him as well!

[Aquagility]

Very good book, whiffey. Have you also read Richard Dawkins -

http://www.amazon.co.uk/God-Delusion-Richard-D awkins/dp/055277331X/ref=sr_1_1/026-9953531-38 50040?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1192009196&sr=1-1

[Doc Spock]

No the calendar does not.

All our so-called religious festivals are pagan in origin.

My life is not affected by some bloke in a fairy story.

[jackthehat]

The evidence supporting the 'existence' of Roman Emperors and Egyptian Pharoahs lies in inscriptions and documents, sometimes spread across several cultures........events recorded at the time.

Hmmm 'very early periods' doesn't really cut the mustard, does it ?
There is nothing from his contemporaries. I haven't read Ian Wilsons book but fail to see how he can make a case out of nothing............

[Doc Spock]

There you go again "Him" with big H. Boy you really do have a problem.

I bet you have to prostrate yourself on the floor when you type Him.

[Theland]

Doc Spock -
How about B.C. to A.D. ?

[whiffey]

Aquagility, I have read a little Richard Dawkins, but never again. His sheer venom towards belief in God pollutes his argument. I don't want to read him for probably similar reasons that the majority of people don't go near the NT anymore.

I have always been amused by how violently upset some people get over the stupidity of religious people. I can feel their feet stamping in indignant frustration ! Come on come on, can't you see how unintelligent, unscientific, it all is ?!!!!