Why Did Ukip Fare (Relatively) Badly In London?

[sp1814]

A greater number of liberal 'chatterati'

A recognition that UKIP don't represent the voice of London?

Fear that some of us will lose our EU home help?

Or a conspiracy amongst the Guardianistas?

Or a disgusting streak of common sense?


http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/may/23/ukip-results-divide-london-rest-england

[Colmc54]

We go down to London regularly to visit our son and family. London has become a foreign city on English soil where the ethnic white UK population is now a minority.

I believe the government should agree to relocate. My suggestion would be Lincoln or York maybe. Imagine the savings for the taxpayer. But London- seriously don't you think the capital city of the nation should be somewhere British and not a foreign city on English soil?

[sp1814]

According to the 2011 census, 36.7% of London's population was foreign born (including 24.5% born outside of Europe)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_groups_in_London

Can we put this to bed now?

[naomi24]

It still means that less than half the population are White British.

[Colmc54]

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/01/10/white-britons-minority_n_2446765.html

[sp1814]

naom24

Yes, but then again, there are areas of the country which are 100% white British.

Ideally, there would be no race clustering, with no area 100% white! and no area 100% black or Asian (or Jewish or whatever). That would be the best way for groups to assimilate - but that is an economic impossibility.

The same is true of areas of America.

I've been to places in New York where practically everyone is Italian, places in Los Angeles where everyone is Latino and places in France which were predominantly Algerian.

Personally, I couldn't give a hoot, but I can understand how uneasy it may make others feel.

By the way - I will get back to you on your earlier question (wasn't ignoring you - had to assemble a table).

[sp1814]

naomi24

I'm not sure whether Farage was defending the UKIP councillor who asked "if you shot one poofter, would the 99 standing behind him decide they weren't gay" or the other councillor who said that people should be free to dislike gay people in the same way that you could dislike Earl Grey tea, but this is an extract from his subsequent interview with Paxman:

Paxman also challenged Farage over the anti-gay comments made by some Ukip figures, including MEP and Newark by-election candidate Roger Helmer. "You've got open homophobes in the party, haven't you?" he asked.

Defending his party, Farage said: "Can you name me a party that hasn't got people [with those views], particularly people over the age of 70, who were brought up at a time when they were taught at school this was wrong?

"This generation was taught to believe this was wrong. For many people of this age and older they still find it difficult."

[naomi24]

sp, //I can understand how uneasy it may make others feel. //

Uneasiness isn't the issue. You asked why Ukip didn't do so well in London.

[naomi24]

//"This generation was taught to believe this was wrong. For many people of this age and older they still find it difficult." //

He's absolutely right - but that's not the same as saying it's ok, as you claimed he did.

[sp1814]

naomi24

I don't believe that it's anything to do with Londoners being more media savvy, or educated (as has been suggested by UKIP). Others have said that 'turkey's don't vote for Christmas'...but there's another possibility...perhaps because London is so cosmopolitan, there are a greater number of people who actually know and/or work with EU and non-EU immigrants and grown accustomed to the change in demographics.

For every person who bemoans the changing face of London, perhaps, just perhaps...there are an equal number who welcome the change?

I'm not going to judge either group...but surely it's possible for both points of view to be acknowledged?

And not just amongst the 'chattering classes', but amongst ordinary people?

[naomi24]

//I don't believe that it's anything to do with Londoners being more media savvy, or educated //

I still don't know where that quote has come from or if it's accurate. From a supporter, it seems a very odd thing to say.

[sp1814]

Regarding Farage's comments.

Perhaps he was being ambivalent...the fact that he doesn't condemn homophobic comments from elderly people means (to me) that he tolerates their views. Which in my opinion means that he thinks it's okay for them to be able to get away with the idea of 'shooting poofters'.

Let's put it this way - if one of his councillors had said, "Do you think if you gassed a Jew, then all the other Jews behind him would suddenly rethink their religious beliefs" - what are the chances of him saying, "Look, many older people grew up in a time when Jews were seen as greedy and untrustworthy".

Or do you think he would immediately condemn the remark?

If you don't make a stand against something, I suppose you could assume ambivalence.

I think what he is saying is, "You have to understand that older people tend to lean towards hatred of gay people, it's not their fault".

[ChillDoubt]

Why Did Ukip Fare (Relatively) Badly In London?

Fairly simple really:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlYiQmrK0Qs

[sp1814]

naomi24

It was UKIP spokeswoman Suzanne Evans:

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/may/23/ukip-councillor-blames-poor-london-polls-cultured-elite

[sp1814]

Thanks ChillDoubt

If this is the case, then it looks like UKIP and London will forever be strangers!

[ChillDoubt]

I've posted this elsewhere this week too.
Even John Cleese sees what is happening in London:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxm1mqbgxcM

[THECORBYLOON]

NAOMI 'Suzanne Evans, the party's communities spokeswoman, was asked by BBC Radio 4's Today programme this morning whether Ukip was finding it hard to win the votes of the "cultured, educated and young". She admitted: "Not in London, no"."There is work to do, I think we haven't really got our message across in London," she said. "As you say, we do have a more media-savvy, well-educated population in London, and they are more likely, I think, to have read some of the negative press that's been about us and I think they've been more likely to believe it.""London is its own person if you like - its own body, its own individual character - and it's very different from the rest of the country," she said."Look at the social demographic. You have lots of metropolitan elite that I think cannot really understand the heartache and the pain that many people around the country are feeling."' The 'cultured' comment was made by someone else I have since discovered but she did not disagree with it.

[Kromovaracun]

well if John Cleese says it, it must be right.

[Colmc54]

Don't mention the war!

[ChillDoubt]

Not really Kromo, just pointing out that when someone as liberal(literally) as Cleese comments on it then you know it must be an issue.

[Gromit]

Is that the John Cleese who is an immigrant in Ametica?