Ladies Only Swimming?

[mushroom25]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5223641/Hampstead-ladies-say-swimming-pond-not-gender-fluid.html

since it's becoming increasingly accepted that gender is less about chromosomes, appearance or reproductive ability but more a matter of state of mind not necessarily requiring reassignment intervention (and the gender recognition act 2004 is likely to be amended to reflect this), are the "X-X" denizens of the Kenwood Ladies Pond Association being a tad unreasonable?

[pixie374]

It hasn't been "increasingly accepted". Gender has always been a state of mind. It's more recently that people have confused sex and gender.

[sp1814]

naomi24

//sp, to put it simply, women are women. Men aren't.//

Yes - that is putting it simply.

It's also wrong.

[Kromovaracun]

Let's put your theory to the test, Naomi.

I'm going to show you five people. Tell me which (if any) you think is male.

https://imgur.com/cmvdidK

https://imgur.com/jLPEGX0

https://imgur.com/CkPItEW

https://imgur.com/E4TmDRG

https://imgur.com/3kupWaz

[hereIam]

^ Oh gawd !!!!

[sp1814]

NJ

I agree with you about those who self-identify as the opposite sex and simply sign a bit of paper. I don't think that's enough.

I'm talking about people who transition to the other sex.

There's a world of difference.

naomi24 doesn't agree that there is any such thing as gender dysmorphia. She thinks that it's just men pretending to be women.

That is absurd.

[Jahulaye]

Kromos links
3 male
1 male
Others unsure

[sp1814]

Krom

Perhaps we should make it a little easier.

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Hrp78EZ4jCQ/maxresdefault.jpg

[naomi24]

Krom, my theory? What is my theory? I know some look absolutely beautiful – the ladyboys of Thailand easily fool me. That doesn’t however, detract from the fact that they're men.

[Kromovaracun]

You can't tell the difference, can you?

[pixie374]

//You would be regarded as a woman, because you were not born biologically male//

Naomi's definition is better than yours, SP! A woman is a "not a man".
I am genuinely surprised with you here- I had always thought you had some respect for women.

[hereIam]

So what, they are STILL men !

[Kromovaracun]

Which ones?

[pixie374]

Only the second one looks female. But as it isn't just about appearance, kromo. How is it even relevant?

[hereIam]

Ladyboys of Thailand of course ...

[naomi24]

Krom, it doesn't matter which ones.

[Kromovaracun]

So if you saw the second person swimming in the women's only pond - you would think them to be female?

[Kromovaracun]

It's relevant because gender and biological sex are different things. And when it comes to gender (not biological sex) - well, actually, it does essentially come down to appearances and how one presents.

[pixie374]

I doubt I would even look that hard, kromo. That's even more scary if you don't even know!

[pixie374]

It's much more than that, kromo. Dressing as a man and striding around, wouldn't make me one.

[anthro-nerd]

Wow, what an interesting thread!! It reminds me of a conversation I had a little while ago when someone asked me why my friend 'chose' to be gay. To which I replied, 'when did you choose to be straight?'. Sexuality isn't a choice, and nor is gender. Your anatomical genitals don't dictate who you are as a person, nor do your chromosomes. You don't choose who you are, you just are. Whilst I'd love to get into a debate about epigenetics, I'm not sure it would benefit this thread! But for those that are interested, I highly recommend reading up on the topic!